Cem Özdemir on the "cityscape": Challenges in migrant communities

Berlin. Cem Özdemir was federal chairman of the Green Party for ten years, rose to become Federal Minister of Agriculture in 2021, and, in the final phase of the traffic light coalition, also took on the role of Minister of Education. Now, the 59-year-old wants to succeed Winfried Kretschmann as Minister-President of Baden-Württemberg. He is taking a considerable risk.

Mr. Özdemir, Germany has been engaged in a "cityscape" debate for weeks, initiated by the Chancellor. What do you, as an Anatolian Swabian, have to say about that?

A chancellor shouldn't act as if he's merely a passive observer. He leads the country. If he simply describes problems without offering solutions, it's practically an invitation: It seems only the AfD is responsible for addressing them. And this statement has led to people feeling targeted whom Mr. Merz later had to say he hadn't meant: people we desperately need in our country, people who are willing to get involved. What bothers me about this whole debate, however, is its simplistic, oversimplified nature.

In what way?

Some close their eyes and pretend we don't have a problem at all, while others give the impression that people with a migration background are responsible for every problem in this country. Neither approach helps. We have to address the problems themselves. And as a trained social worker, I know that lecturing doesn't compete with experience. So, if people feel unsafe in public spaces, then we have to take care of it. And we have to do so across party lines if we don't want to lose even more people to the AfD. This also includes addressing toxic masculinity and phenomena like crime as a "lifestyle."

And what do you say to people who find the Chancellor's statement racist?

There are migrant-influenced communities where archaic and patriarchal structures are entrenched, posing a particular threat to women. But there are also places in Germany—especially in parts of eastern Germany—where people with a migration background feel unsafe because they don't look like they're voting directly for the Vikings. I would like us to fight tooth and nail against any kind of restriction of freedom and self-determination—with the goal that everyone can feel safe anywhere in Germany at any time, in Zwickau just as much as around Frankfurt's main train station.

Let's talk about the election campaign: You moved from Berlin to Stuttgart. What is the biggest difference between the two cities?

In Berlin, you're further removed from people's everyday lives. State politics and the political landscape in Stuttgart are closer to home – whether at the VfB Stuttgart stadium in Untertürkheim, in a pub, or while shopping. Empty rhetoric doesn't get you very far there. That's why the crucial question for me is: Where are the places where we can come together? The village pub in rural areas is dying out. Clubs are struggling with declining membership. That's where I want to focus my efforts.

You're a pragmatist. The Greens at the federal level are leaning more to the left again after their election defeat. Do you feel sufficiently supported if your own party members don't contradict you?

First of all, I have fantastic support from my own party here in Baden-Württemberg. They elected me as their lead candidate with 97 percent of the vote. I don't think the Greens have ever achieved such results anywhere else. Furthermore, I feel completely at ease with a Minister-President who, for 15 years, has pursued policies that consider the entire state. He stands in a long tradition. Think of names like Fritz Kuhn, Biggi Bender, or Reinhard Bütikofer. I intend to continue their course – a course that doesn't view ecology as being in opposition to the economy and has internalized the fact that rural areas operate differently than cities, and that security is a fundamental human need. You could jokingly say that in Baden-Württemberg, we're a bit like the CSU of the Greens.

You didn't mention one name who, in a way, also belongs in this group: former Green Party member Boris Palmer. At one point, it was said that you wanted to bring him back into the party. Now I hear that, after he sat on stage with an AfD member, that's off the table.

I didn't attend the event myself. But from what I've read, he certainly gave the AfD candidate a good run for his money. I respect that. Boris Palmer is an extremely successful mayor of Tübingen. He delivers on what others only promise: regarding environmental issues, transportation policy, and housing policy. He's doing a brilliant job. I deeply regret that he inflicted so much damage on himself with unnecessary Facebook battles at midnight. In any case, I consult closely with Boris Palmer when it comes to the functioning of the state or the role of local authorities. He's an important advisor to me in these matters—as are other mayors in the state, because they know best what matters to people locally. The issue of party membership isn't currently relevant for either of us.

One contentious issue is the phase-out of combustion engines from 2035 onwards. They say the direction must be clear, but there should be flexibility in the timeline. Not everyone in your party shares this view.

Let's be clear: it was a CDU Commission President, a predominantly conservative Commission with a conservative Parliament and Council, who decided on this. The problem is: nothing was done afterward to achieve the goal. But instead of criticizing this and asking where the European charging infrastructure is, where the unambiguous commitment to vehicle tax exemption until 2035, where the affordable charging electricity is, we're having endless debates about specific dates. That won't make our fleet _CO2 -neutral. The crucial thing is to get started. I'm in favor of flexibility in the timeline, provided there's clarity about the goal. My request, therefore, is that we stop discussing dates abstractly and start taking action. That's what will help the climate, jobs, and our economy the most. And it provides investment security.

How threatening is the economic situation from your point of view?

The problem isn't just the shift to electric vehicles. There are also Trump's tariffs and the loss of market share in China. And, of course, the problem is that we are simply too expensive as a production location in Germany. This puts all eyes on Berlin. Berlin could certainly do something by using the money from the special fund to advance Germany as a business location – for example, by reducing bureaucracy, lowering electricity prices, ensuring we have a decent infrastructure, and finally integrating demographic change into the social security systems. I see no sign of any of that happening. Therefore, my advice is that we take the bull by the horns. We must ensure that we maintain our technological leadership where we have it – and regain it where we have lost it.

This means you will focus your election campaign on the economy.

The great historian Fritz Stern identified pessimism as one of the reasons for the failure of the Weimar Republic, because the National Socialists deliberately badmouthed their own country. There are certain parallels to how the AfD talks about Germany. Yes, we have problems. We have missed many opportunities. The Guardian once wrote that we are an analog country in the digital age. But the good news is: all of this can be changed. We just need to finally ensure that we no longer judge proposals by who makes them, but by whether they are good or bad. That means: less party politics and showing that we've taken notice. In any case, I don't want the AfD to be able to provide a state premier for the first time in the history of the Federal Republic of Germany in next year's state elections in eastern Germany. We will only prevent this if we wake up now and initiate the necessary reforms for our country.

That means?

The SPD must be prepared, building on Agenda 2010, to stop pretending that demographic change is a specter. It's a reality. The baby boomers will be retiring in the coming years. You can't simultaneously introduce early retirement at 63 and finance the active pension system. That's nonsense. The CDU must be prepared to acknowledge that everyone has to contribute to social equity, including those who are better off economically. And we Greens, while acknowledging the need for species protection, mustn't try to protect every single individual and should be willing to work more with incentive systems. If every party is willing to overcome its own limitations, we'll get this mess sorted out. But continuing as before would be nothing more than a boon for the AfD.

It's striking that the Left Party, polling at 7 percent, could enter the state parliament for the first time. Do you have a platform for their voters?

The Left Party is currently benefiting from the national trend. I see no ambition to shape policy in this country. They don't want to govern, to shape policy, and therefore to bring about change. I want to bring about change. I want to ensure that there are affordable apartments for young people through a housing program, while at the same time giving young families the opportunity to own their own homes with low-interest mortgages. I want to ensure we have access to medical care in rural areas, that urban and rural areas become more integrated, and that the gap between them doesn't widen further. We don't need to shy away from addressing the issue of justice.

Her stated goal is to become Prime Minister.

That's what I'm running for.

What if that doesn't work? In your view, would the position of deputy minister-president in a black-green coalition then be a nice consolation prize?

The race is wide open. We were at 17 percent and are now at 20 percent. The CDU is coming up short. They were at 34 percent, then 30, now they're at 29. Ultimately, it all comes down to a very simple question: Who do the people of Baden-Württemberg trust to lead the state through these challenging times? I want to show what this state is capable of. A state that's on par with California and Massachusetts in research and development. I want to break the chains that are holding us back. If you want me, you have to vote for the Greens. But not just any Greens, the Baden-Württemberg Greens. They're like me – pragmatic in their approach, clear in their goals.